The Messenger – A chat with Joe Claussell

Over the years, Joaquin “Joe” Claussell has forged a reputation as one of the most original and uncompromising producers and DJs on the planet. An integral part of the famous Body and Soul club, he has mesmerised audiences around the globe with his soulful, crowd-orientated sets of unending diversity and musicality. As a part of the Dance tracks record store and later head of the Spiritual Life label (www.spirituallifemusic.com), he has given an outlet for the music he feels the people should be hearing, and his recent tracks on Ibadan still astound with their style, elegance and feeling.

I hope after reading the interview you’ll see what I mean. Brendan Greene and I caught up with Joe on his European tour recently to talk about music, life and other mysteries …

DHN - How is your label, Spiritual Life Music doing?

Joe Claussell - Beautifully – we’re really excited about what we are doing. Since starting in 1996 a few years ago I thought of Spiritual Life as an outlet to introduce more live deep music in the industry which at that time was non-existent, but I started from a record store so kind of prematurely. Now it’s like 2002 and its more treated as a label. I have much more staff and to do much more to expose this music in the right way which is what it’s all about and we’re really excited because we have a lot of projects, and artists that we are very excited about. We have Jephte Guillaume, who has been with us since the beginning. We have Three Generations Walking, which consists of MKL and SOS and we have a group called Slam Mode – they are a duo that produce really deep, atmospheric, mostly electronic with some organic music. Right now as we speak we have our first Spiritual Life compilation that has been released as a double CD, consisting of two parts. One CD is is from our past, which was originally released on a Spiritual life compilation on Nuphonic, and the second is new material from upcoming artists. We’re really excited about that.

DHN - You used to own a record store Dance Tracks - how much involvement did you have in running it, and did it interfere in your other work much?

JC - Dance Tracks was created in 1988, by the owner Stan Hatzkein. I credit him with why I’m here today. I took it over in 1993 with a partner, and after the migration to Spiritual Life, I gave up my part in Dance Tracks, so I’m no longer involved. But I did cultivate the vibe from Dance Tracks, and put a lot of time into it in the beginning. My partner at the time was more of a financial person, and I was more the creative person. I did what I could at that time and music started changing more and more and I started getting more heavily involved in producing, re-mixing and obviously DJing. But regardless, Dance Tracks was still more of my priorities, definitely because it was very important to have a record store at that time and it is most definitely very important to have one now, to preach what we felt was good music and is. It’s good to have an institute like that to do that besides a club or just DJing so it is very important part of my life and it is something that I want to do again. But I think I divided my time between the five pretty well. It’s just that it was the right time for me to leave that behind and pursue the labels – Spiritual Life and myself, as a person.

DHN - Your name has grown in tandem with that of Body and Soul, which has become a house music institution. What were your original reasons for getting involved with it?

JC - My original reason for getting involved in the club – well I must tell you that, first of all I refused to be involved in Body & Soul from the very beginning. Francoise K asked me to do it before the party started and I said no to doing it because all of the negativities in the industry. I learned a lot from having a record store. You see a lot of egos, a lot of trash talking and stuff like that – the industry was full of that as I think it is even more full of it now. So I didn’t want to get involved in anything that didn’t have to do with the purity of the music – just like my store – it was more about music than anything else – it wasn’t about having a cool record store or anything – it was about getting and selling great music – what we thought was beautiful music. Same thing I wanted to be involved with in anything else in my life. Being involved in something as big as Body and Soul with Francois K and Danny Krivit, these two guys who were DJing way longer than I was, and at the venue that it was which was the original Shelter a while ago, I think it was too big for me in a sense that I thought that it would at some point kind of distort my view of music or whatever. I wanted to stay true to what I was doing and something as grand or as big as that would probably make me grow musically but negatively I think – only because I have seen that in the industry myself from having a record store. But it hasn’t done that at all to me. To get back to your original question – I turned it down for at least five months because of those reasons – I didn’t want to be involved in hype, I didn’t want to be involved in bullshit – I was only until Larry Levan’s birthday party that Francois insisted I play at that party and I said yes and I did it and had an incredible time. That time was truly my birth as a DJ because from then I really started DJing every week outside of my own store, which was my club anyway, y’know? My reasons for doing it were simply the people – the reassurance that you can do a party without the hype, without the egos and the bullshit that comes with this industry.

DHN - What amazes me when I see you live is that it seems to take you about 30 seconds or often less to cue up a record, and then the headphones are off until the next one. Any advice for DJs that you’re impressing and depressing at the same time?

JC - Well unfortunately yesterday – there is a clock there and by the time the clock got there I figured I only had 2 hours, which is annoying to me. The owner of the club seriously stressed to me how really tight and respectful he is in terms of the time of when the party’s going to end and so that put me in a little bit of a rush – trying to get as much music in there as possible, because it’s very important to me and even then I didn’t notice I was that fast in putting music on because I am generally a person who pretty much plays music if the record calls for it – I play it to the end and then put the next one on, whatever. A good tune is a good tune, definitely. In terms of the speed, if I am fast whatever it would have to do a lot with the time that I have. If I had more time it would be definitely much more but the way I choose records is simple. The crowd helps me choose a record not myself – I don’t come with a programme, never come with a programme, that’s why I come with a lot of records. I’m not a “DJ DJ” – I’m a musical messenger but it has so much to do with the crowd – the energy of the crowd. That’s how I DJ we do it together – it’s like I’m always looking to see what the reaction because it’s very important and they teach me. You’re allowed to play U2, whatever that’s them telling me I can do that.

DHN - You certainly seem to get into the music once you’re in the middle of a good mix – what do you love most about house music?

JC - Once again, what I love about house music is both the music and the people that are dancing to it. House music or music in general - it’s beautiful when you are listening to it on your own – music is my life - but in terms of house music which I don’t listen to much at home – when you are playing for a crowd, you appreciate it much more than you ever did because the energy and the beauty of the people that are grooving to it. I pretty much had tears in my eyes a few times yesterday. And it’s not just because of house music – the combination of the house music, myself and the energy of the people there. There is simply not many things that can make you feel like that in the world, especially when you’re in the right place like being in Cork. It’s like it can’t compare to many things in my life.

DHN - Many see you as the best house DJ in the world today – who else would you say deserves this high praise?

JC - To be honest with you – at this point in my life I don’t have a favourite house DJ My favourite DJ passed away a long time ago. I became a DJ from home, my brothers and my mother and they instilled in me the love I have for music and I only learned what a DJ really was then. We used to have block parties/block associations on our streets and my family that loved music so much and my older brother – his name is Larry Claussell would bring his huge stereo outside for free – big stereo – put in right in front of our house and jam for the people. That’s the first time I saw it and that’s the first time that I said, “Wow”, like, “This is a beautiful feeling”. So that’s where I really got my love for music and the whole DJing thing but there was one DJ that inspired me and I know a lot of people use this for reference or whatever but for me truly one DJ that inspired me – I still don’t see a DJ do for me today – is Larry Levan from the because going into his party was like – there’s not an experience in the world that I’ve seen yet today like that – the way he was just there to play anything – it’s like you would go in and you would hear reggae at the Paradise Garage amongst the main formula of music that was being play which was dance music and house music at the time. You would hear reggae, you would hear alternative rock and that is what opened my eyes to let me know that you can do that in a crowd because that is the way I listened to music too. So he just awakened that in me even more. Even though if I had never been in the Paradise Garage, I would be DJing the way I DJ now in that style anyway but he is the one who told me by going to listen to him – its okay, and no other DJ does that even today. The closest thing to that unfortunately is Body & Soul because it’s all about house music. It’s all about master mixing, it’s all about nothing but house music and there are DJs that are afraid in a big club to throw in a reggae record in a major place – to me that’s a problem. And Larry Levan is the only DJ I know that’s ever done that for me. You’d walk into that place and you would see people grooving. When I first walked into that place, the Paradise Garage it just blew me away. Before that I used to go to clubs where it was about the mixing like a place called The Inferno or Rene Hewitt back in the middle 80’s - a great mixer and that was the kind of DJ I thought I wanted to be – make sure that my mixing was all tight and if it goes off-beat I’m a little nervous and that was all cool and everything but when I went to hear this guy Larry Levan – he just threw all of that out of the window and to me DJs today when the mix is the most important thing – it bores me. Because you cannot get funky with master-mixing all night in my opinion – for me. Most people have their own opinions like the mix is more important to them but for me it is impossible – I want to hear reggae. I want you to shock me with reggae, I want you to shock me with some alternative vibe, that’s what’s going to make me go off on a record – that is my style of DJing.

So unfortunately today I have DJs I admire but I don’t have a favourite DJ I admire Timmy Registford from the Shelter, I admire Louis Vega– also I admire a lot of upcoming DJs that are willing to take the chance more. Like we have someone that used to work for me called Funmi someone that works for me now called Paul Nickerson, this young kid, about 25 – maybe even younger that that – the younger generation is willing to take a chance in DJing. I have someone who also works for me called Kamati Pinkston who works with me and these DJs – these younger guys that are willing to take it to the next level and there are a host of DJs like that, that are not known, that are ready for it! Even artists of mine that are the same way like Slam Mode, MKL from Three Generation Walking – all really good DJs and are willing to take it to the next level. Whereas your question to me about a DJ today that’s my favourite DJ – I don’t have that. I think what people like about my DJing is that and I’ve always heard this from people, is that they feel sincerely from me – I’m not actually a DJ – I hate the term DJ for myself. I love going on and playing music and once again it’s the respect. I’m in the hand of the audience, the crowd and they tell me – we do it together. I like playing a variety of different kind of music and one thing that this DJ- my favourite DJ still in the world who God bless his soul is not here any more – has showed me that it ain’t all about the mixing – it is not all about the mixing – its about the music. It’s about how you are going to bring people up and down, back and forth, the emotions, and the memories of a song. The bpm could be from 110 and the next song could be 120 – it doesn’t matter. Consistency and giving everyone a beautiful time that’s what it’s all about – so that’s my long answer to your question!

DHN - Roughly how many countries have you toured in the last 2 years, and what would be your favourites to play?

JC - I do a lot of touring but I don’t do as much touring because no. 1 – I don’t think there is many venues to go to. I do a lot of touring but not as much as I’m requested to do because I have a lot of other responsibilities. I have my label Spiritual Life and I am working on myself more as a producer other than re-mixing and I just have a lot to do but I have been to a lot of places. I have been to most all over Italy, I’ve been to a lot of places in Europe, Asia, I’ve been to Singapore, Malaysia, Japan – I’m on my way to a Japanese tour in about 3 weeks now and I’ve done a lot.

DHN - What are your favourite places to DJ?

JC - No. 1 – Japan, and a very close second if not equally is Cork, Ireland. I can tell you that right now. And there is only one other place that shocked me in terms of they loving their deep house and its in Sardinia, Italy and you would be amazed in Italy there would be like this love of deep house. It reminded me a little bit of Cork – deep house all night long. But like I say I’m not a DJ so it is very important for me to go to places where I can express myself truly and with the help of the audience and there are not many places that you can do that because a lot of times unfortunately I get called to DJ because I’m part of Body & Soul but the great thing about it is I go and still do what I do and I’m always called back to do that, which is a beautiful thing. But the places that I feel right at home doing it is Japan and Cork. I love playing in Toronto, there’s a place called Garage 416 which is a beautiful place to play as well as I think I pretty much opened them up to this style of music as well where you can play what you want to play.

DHN - Of course, the downside of all the touring is that you’re not producing as much as many people would ideally like. Are you happy to devote more time to DJing at the moment, or is this something you’re going to concentrate more on in future?

JC - I would love to produce more but even when I’m in New York I have so many things to do with the label and everything like that even though I have Kamati Pinkston who runs the daily operations of the label but even then I’m just incredibly busy and I would love to produce more – that’s what in the years to come what I’ll be doing more and hope to be doing less DJing. Right now I DJ to promote the music and it is very important to do that. If you look at the rosters of parties going on – the biggest music that’s out there is progressive music, the biggest DJ’s are progressive DJ’s and we need more of myself and other DJ’s in that style like yourselves and everything from here to preach, to keep this music alive and it’s one of the main reasons why I’m out there a lot but I’m trying to do that less and in the way for us to do that as a unit in terms of Spiritual Life and everything – if you want to get more of our DJ’s out there that preach sort of the same message through their music so I can do it less and concentrate more on producing because I want to develop more as a producer. I haven’t really done anything in terms of re-mixing and producing yet because I come from a wide genre, a variety of music that I want to do and I haven’t had a chance to do it yet but I want to do more of that - and I am working on my first full-length album which is called Cosmic Ritual and I’m working on that and I find very little time to do that and in order for me to do that there would have to be less DJing. The important thing about me DJing now is I’m almost like a scout as well. I go out and I come back and report which is the best place for our people to play at and that’s what I’m pretty much doing now so that then I can do less of it.

DHN - As a producer, you’re famous for coming up with a more organic sound, influenced by a variety of more traditional music styles like Latin and African music. What turned you on to these styles, and what do you feel they bring to house music?

JC - Well first of all I’m Puerto Rican and also Puerto Ricans as with Cubans, we come from the Ruba tribe from Africa and Nigeria so being that it’s only natural that I will produce with African and Latin rhythms because that is my heritage. But at the same time when I get more time to produce you hear other styles, you hear out of the context of my heritage. My first love was rock music so I grew up listening to that along with everything else. As I develop more as producer you will hear more variations – different sides of Joe Claussell.

DHN - Where do you see your future production style going, or do you have any way of knowing?

JC - I see it naturally progressing – I can’t tell you what’s going to be. I don’t have any set plans – “Oh you know what, I want to be this kind of DJ, I want to be this kind of producer, I want to produce this kind of music” – no, when it happens, it happens. Like I was asked to work on a Nina Simone re-mix for Verve Remix Project that just was released and if you listen to my re-mix of my Nina Simone, its quite different than anything I’ve ever done and that’s because it was what I was feeling at the time and everyone thought I would do a house music type thing to it but, it was more of an R&B thing I did. If you listen to it you’ll see it’s very different from my usual work, and that was a natural decision to do that. This is kind of what I want this to be – it fits better this way and I produced it, and I got a great response to that. There’s no percussion whatsoever.

DHN - You seem to have a great regard for some of the pioneers of house music, like Ten City in particular. What are the main differences in the music and the vibe of today and 10 years ago?

JC - People like Ten City were delivering a message through their music which is very much missing in house music now. A lot of the house music today is very gimmicky. There’s only very few strong vocal records – the strongest vocal record that came out in a long time in terms of house music vocal records – one of the ones for me was KOT “Finally” which is an amazing record that she was saying something. There are not many vocal records like that today. A lot of clichés, the same lyrics being used and its like if you listen to music even disco records back in the days – they were saying something and its just very important for us to try to get back to that. Guys like Ten City deliver that message to us beautifully – we hear what they are saying. There are some still left that do that obviously Blaze always delivers a beautiful message in their songwriting, but we need much more.

DHN - New York artists like Solu continue to make an impression on the world house scene. Who do you see as the artists both from New York and beyond, that we should be looking out for?

JC - I don’t know if anyone new that I can think of at the moment but there are people that have done something that just needs more breathing space to really say what they want to say musically. You have people like Roland Clark, who is still an incredible songwriter who needs to do more and it’s such a cliché to say this but there are people on my label that I’m very musically that have so much to say like Slam Mode and Three Generations Walking – you have to look out for people like that in terms of house music. And they’re not just house – they’re other things besides house – they are a mixture of so many different influences but they have a message with their music which is very important. It is very difficult because there isn’t many … I really off the top of my head cannot think of anyone that is doing that, that delivers a message in their lyrics and everything – I can’t. The only one still doing that you still hear a song and someone is Blaze and like I said we need more help doing that and “Fade” is an incredibly beautiful song – it’s a personal song and I just think we need songs with more message to uplift the world to show, to give hope and like I said there’s not enough artists doing that right now. I really cannot think of anyone that is really blowing me away, in that way.

DHN - So why did you decide to play “Fade” as your last tune last night?

JC - It wouldn’t have been my last term if there was more time – if there was more time there would have been more considered in the middle of the set whatever but it was natural. It was not like I’m going to play “Fade” for the last song.

DHN - Any idea that it was such a big tune here [in Cork]?

JC - No, I had no idea. That’s what I mean about energy, positively the energy from the creator and the music that both the crowd and the DJ share together because I look through my things and said “OK this will be the last song” – there’s no plan – I’m not a DJ like that, I don’t have any plans of what I’m doing to do and “Fade” happened to be the last record and that’s the way it happened.

DHN - Given your achievements and involvement in so many aspects of the industry, you seem to be a very driven and ambitious person. Would you agree with this, and what would you say are your main personality traits?

JC - I can’t talk about myself in that way – that’s very hard. I wouldn’t be able to answer that question but I can say that every day I’m growing more and more spiritually and more and more wanting to be a better person. Every day I try to do that, that’s what I can tell you; and if anyone who comes to talk to me looking up to me as a DJ or whatever, they wouldn’t really see that from me because once again I don’t really consider myself a DJ, I’m like a messenger playing this music. I know looking at myself the way other people look at me – I come do my thing, I have to have a few drinks before I DJ because I’m so nervous before doing it – still to this day and that’s it.

DHN - It is refreshing to see that it’s not about money for you and more about giving your music to the people, whereas nowadays DJs are obsessed with playing the latest hits…

JC - Exactly, and for a DJ, they won’t feel comfortable unless they have an arsenal of unreleased songs and to me that’s boring. It’s like when you’re DJing it’s about memories too – its like I’m on the dance floor, I want to go dancing and what’s going to get me to dance is – I think I’ll play some new tunes or whatever but what’s going to get them dancing – something that plays something that takes me back somewhere. Too many DJs concentrate on just new records and how they’re mixing them or whatever and they don’t tell a story. A story is very important for me. You gotta tell a story. One thing I would advise any DJ – don’t worry about how great you mix. Because I can do a show of mixing all night long, I can definitely do that – that’s what I came from, I came from mixing but it’s not going to do anything for me and I don’t really think it really does anything for the crowd. It will for a crowd as hype with a name like overseas but when you come to somewhere like Cork where they know their music and it’s one of the places that amazes me so because the women here are so beautiful too but I know this because I had a chance to see everyone come in and no matter if it’s the beautiful women or the guys whatever, they come in, they take their coats off and they are already grooving to deep house. How many places for me in the world that that happens I can tell you - not many. I can tell you that right now. Not many. And I always tell people from France or whatever or anyone that I know – you’ve got to go to DJ in Cork because there’s rarely a place like this. It’s just amazing here. I am wondering why it took me two years to come here.

DHN - I know you played Sweat [Cork club]…

JC - When I DJ there and it’s an amazing place, but once again it doesn’t matter where you are, it’s the people that bring the party and that’s what it is. You can have it in an apartment, a hole in the wall, the love for that music, that’s what makes a party!

DHN - Finally, you must be pretty well-off by now. What is your attitude to money in general, and does it bring happiness? Are you happy now?

JC - I’m not rich or anywhere near rich. I’ll tell you honestly- when I DJ now, I don’t DJ for money for myself, I DJ for money for Spiritual Life. That’s what I do because we are a label that preaches different music and it’s not as you see the majority of house music – it’s not the most popular music because the most popular music comes from the big, big names and progressive music or whatever so we don’t put out music as much as everyone else puts out music and there’s that and there are people that have to be paid, there’s music that has to be pressed or whatever and there is concepts that we have to develop and all of that costs money. So when I make money, I make money for the whole of what we are trying to do. So money does not make me happy. I am blessed to make the money that I do so that I can support the bigger picture and it’s not supporting what we do at Spiritual Life but for the kind of music that we do in general and for anyone else that wants to produce this kind of music. Someone has to go out there and expose this sound because otherwise it would die and that doesn’t come cheap. That comes with money. Me, I’m a normal kind of guy, I’m much, much, much less materialistic that I have ever been in my life. I have to buy myself a little bit of clothes sometimes, whatever but I don’t need huge amounts of money. I don’t need to flaunt that I have a lot of money – it’s all about a much bigger plan, a much bigger picture and that’s why I go out to make the money that I do. But just to have money to have it for myself would not make me happy at all. I think it’s for me what’s more than money for me is coming out and just having this connection once again with a crowd of people that truly appreciate what we both do, meaning both myself and them together – money just cannot compare to that, man. That’s what makes me happy.

Look out for these releases from Spiritual Life Music, out now

Femi Kuti - Black Man Know Yourself / What Will Tomorrow Bring (The Spiritual Life Mixes)
Joe Claussell - Git Wa

Also coming soon on Spiritual Life ...

Spiritual Life Vinyl LP (compilation)
Still Phil (feat Camilla T) - Beautiful
Slam Mode - Uhuru [Part 1] (CD and Vinyl)
3 Generations Walking (CD and LP)
Joe Claussell Mix CD

and ...

Joe Claussell - Music ... A Reason To Celebrate [CD] on BBE Records.

With thanks to ONE nightclub in Cork & Anthony Mooney and MCD in Dublin.

Ken [DeepHouseNetwork]